Hey Guys, this is kinda like a rant / plea for some half decent advice

I've been trying to make decent sites for some time now, that bring in a few extra quid here n there.
Im not looking to make millions.  As I know once I have a few good sites that bring in a few quid a day I can scale them so it isnt much of a problem.

Im finding it hard starting off though.
I have a great idea for a website, its simple, but if people liked it, it could take off big style.
The problem is if i made it, I have no idea how to go about getting people to use it.

The niche is extremely saturated so

SEO

  traffic would be next to impossible even though the site is unique and afaik its never been done before.
Advertising on other websites requires money I dont have.
And most the players in the field are too big to link to a small site [I would have thought?]

But I know there is no direct competition for this website it just happens to sit and feed off a big niche.
So how the hell am i meant to get people to use it?!

Anyone have any ideas?
P.s. i have been purposefully vague because ive not made it yet, gimmie a week or so and i might have it made.

vague is fine.

to start, build it. sometimes you'd be surprised that it doesnt turn out how you thought. but if it does.
traffic is the issue. the best way is to search digg and assorted big blogs to find articles that relate to what you are doing. post an intelligent comment with your link, even just in your username is fine. if the comment is intelligent, and not just "great blog", you'll get visitors. but at least you also get a link.

True dude true.

I suppose I dont want to invest a few months of my time making and then promoting a site if its not going to work.
But then again if you dont try you dont get anywhere!

I think one of the problems at the minute is that I havent got a

net

 work of mates who I can use to bounce off.
I.e. i launch a site, if its related they blog about it or link to it etc. And vice versa.

But then to get a

net

 work of peeps ya need to spend all your life on forums [like im starting to do with this one lol] and never get anything done! ARGH catch 22!!

NBs is right MM - the biggest secret to success is to actually do something.

IMO, you should be equally confortable with the fact that it might meet or exceed your expectations, or fall completely flat and die. With any business venture, you must simply analyze the risks and decide if the potential upside is worth the risk of complete and utter failure. It's not magic - the best business people simply have a more keen sense of what will be a good gamble. And more often than not, this is not a gift at birth - it's a hard earned skill born of some really nasty failures.

Give it a go mate - don't extend yourself into your savings any more than you must to give it a try and see what happens. Do yourself this one favor: do not rely on it for anything except the personal satisfaction of taking the leap. Restrictions/limitations/requirements on an infant business 99% of the time are the kiss of death.


/p

i totally get that. its the biggest issue. so rough it out. dont spend any time on "pretty". just get the basic features done. then make it pretty enough to show some folks. say what you are going to add. if they like it, power through to the end, if not, still can go forward, they just might not be the right crowd. up to you. The downside of bouncing off of friends is, they lie. "oh that great! you did that? im impressed!"  if i wanted to be jerked off i would put on some porn and do it myself. its hard to make it clear that you want honesty. they arent going to hurt your feelings. they have to know that, if they dont, its no point in asking.

<sophomoricJocularity>
The JBomb must be REALLY DISTRACTED if your outsourcing has been cut off 
</sophomoricJocularity>

LOL that could make a good website, jerkmeoff.com its like friend finder but slightly different....

Cheers for the comments guys
I think I'll definately go ahead with it.

Will let ya know how it goes!

<quote>NBs is right MM - the biggest secret to success is to actually do something.</quote>
Yep pretty much about it .
Kinda like people who make stupid comments like i wish i could code as good as u.
Well buddy do it for like 8 years 20 hours a day
Actually do anything for 8 years 20 hours a day

I believe in gambling.
As in look at how much you risk, look at what they gains are.
Most people thier opinions in most things are worth little.
Ussually they either tell u it great like NB said, when it stupid idea,
Or they tell u it stupid idea when it good idea.

Anyway get off ur ass and start coding 

Monkey, in some post on this board you say :

Looks to me you've already got a popential userbase. Just build your site as planned and get some people from that other site you're running to come test/play.

Completely different sites though, I can't really transfer them or sell them.
I had thought about developing more sites in my existing niche, which I have done to an extent, but they are generally sods to m

onet

 ize.

Good idea though, cant knock it, just dont think itd work given the subjects [next time gadget.....next time]

I do as well 100%.

My only add would be that most people come to the table thinking, "Look at how much I could make!" rather than, "I am confortable losing all of this money." The problem for people in any gamble is they are focused on the upside without a REAL appreciation for the potential downside. Upside is easy to deal with. Unanticipated downside can be a killer.

I had an argument with someone once who said that she and I were both the same in our optimism. I had to answer that her form of optimism was to fly forward at full speed with her hands over her eyes - never quite knowing if she is a mile high or inches from disaster. My personal form of optimism is to create a bed of nails which encapsulates every possible way I can imagine getting fished in a situation... then lying on that bed looking up seeing where I can possible go. Amoun used to say he's an optimist as well... "See! The knife is half OUT of my back!" 

Realistically assess the risks and your tolerance and then throw the throttle to the floor. That's the only way to do it.

/p

this is equivalent to what I have come to call the "punch in the face factor" or the Pff.

its basically howmuch money would it require for you to allow someone to punch you in the face. This mostly relates to clients. Stupid clients are high PFF. really nice clients who pay well, respect you, etc, low pff. Your best client is someone you'd be willing to "do a favor" for, buy temporarily reducing your fee for example.

when It comes to doing a project for yourself however, you have noone to punch you in the face you assume. oh but no, your wrong. the universe has a giant fist, and its got enough whoop ass for everyone. When I start a personal project, i really only tend to look at how much money i can lose by focusing on it. not just directly, out of pocket, but also indirectly by not taking on client work as an example. Its the normal risk/reward scenario, but so many people get blinded by the possible reward.

Assume the reward will be great, otherwise you wouldn't have been interested in the idea in the first place.

A huge-fisted, universal whoop ass.  How incredibly true

TD's law #2 "You always miss 100% of the shots you don't take"

Cheers,
td

I have decided, to go for broke
And tackle some of the big boys.

In my current niche I am top for the search terms I want, but that only required some careful link text, and good on site

seo

 .
Currently get about 300k hits a month on it, but not very profitable.

So I think im gonna bite the bullit and make a site in a very competetive market.
I think it will be the only way for me to

learn

  more techniques to stay on top.
At current I employ no "out the box" techniques to rank well or get traffic. Something that I need to

learn

 , so no better way to do it than on the job.

If anyone has any advice on where to start with any "out the box" techniques etc feel free to let me know
Wish me luck!!!

Tenacity and perserverance. Also, there's no magic - it's just discipline and working the game. Take your competitors action apart as best you can - document it, test for yourself, rinse repeat. Lots. Go man - love to hear about your results.

/p

Cheers perk [can i call u perk? lol]
Not gonna have time to start it for a week or so I reckon
Got a lot on plus have another website to do first
Damn full time work

Not if you expect me to answer 

KIDDING  - actually perk was my nick as a touring musician a long time ago... it is part of a couple other humourous pieces that make today's nick. I still enjoy it.



Totally get it. Damn clients have me so busy I can't get any work done 

/p

Maybe youd get more work done if you stopped wearing the purple hat 
[avatar]

Perk --> 

story of my life pal.

Hi,
i am a total newbie.
i am totatlly clueless

Meanwhile in another post, posted some

mac

 ro that unrolls loops
(that i have no idea how it works, and no desire to

learn

 

I should show u the source for my facial recognition program one day, ur eyes will fall out
I did it before I knew how to optimize tho so its slooowwwww

p.s. dont try understand Duff, itll make ur brain bleed
Just use it and rejoice.

Easy noppersaurus, he claims to lack

SEO

 /SEM skills, not

programming

  skills.

Actually im not bad with general

seo

  etc [white hat]
I am top of my small niche, but my issue was that I am unsure how to translate that to being "a player" in a huge niche
if that makes sense

Performance anxiety I guess

Oh and yeah and course I can code ya muppet! Wouldnt be here if i couldnt code, id probably be on another forum asking how to make cool transforms in flash - but they are bloody cool tho lol

Actually, walking through it and getting it made me feel very happy and peaceful. I'm going to include that code in my mantra when I'm going to my "Happy Place."

Don't mind nop MM - he's brilliant, but hell, lives in the PH so you can easily flame him for HOURS before he wakes up.

/p

SEO

 /SEM what there to know about it.
I have no idea about a real website i never made one of those.

Anyway make a content generator.
That makes cool shit for people to search for on the

net

 .
Make a generator for backlinks.

For the marketing part redirect the <>morons to a page chock full of disgusting ads.
For the affiliate programs, ask yourself, is this moronic, tasteless, disgusting or pointless ?
If you answer yes to 3/4 it a good program.
money comes in.
see very simple that will be $10K USA dollar. Please send with western union wire

You know all those empire type games you played as a teenager.
The ones where your parents/

teach

 ers said don't waste your time playing that shit.
Those games will never

teach

  you how to make money.

well guess what

SEO

  kinda like those games, except a whole lot bigger and more fun.
and you can do what ever u want, and instead of just getting points u get $$$$

SO TRUE.

nop u genius lol

p.s. where is PH?
Im from England

ph = philippines
since you are from england you are forgiven

It amazes me when americans are ignorant of the location of Ph.
lets see site of some of the largest and most important battles of WW2

A favorite location of one of USA's general's who if he had not declined would have been president instead of eisenhower.
(This general prefered to be an emperor instead )

Uncle Doug huh?

Also the site of Immelda's shoe museum 

Hell dude, lots of Yanks don't know where Australia is and we're big and funny looking 

I remember going on a train across the Nullabor plain when I was a kid and a big yank in a ten gallon hat saying that he honestly didn't thin Australia was as big as Texas....... lol. Of course I knifed him, it was the only decent thing to do 

Cheers,
td

And.  They brew a wonderful light pilsner.

Extraordinarily humane, and one of the reasons Smart Yanks love you Aussies 

There's this other Texan over here right now causing a lot of trouble... say, is there anything you can do? 

/p

Where is australia?

Just wait until he's near a grassy knoll or a book repository and then you..........

Cheers,
td