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Author Topic: Apple / FCC update  (Read 2998 times)
isthisthingon
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« on: August 04, 2009, 02:40:21 PM »

It's on!  Apple, or the king with no clothes, is realizing the world is starting to see it's nakedness.  Here's a sample:

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While Apple goes about defending its iPhone Apps Store from the perceived threat of Google Voice, Google is extending that fledgling service for free to the men and women who defend our country.

Score another public relations round for Google.

Sgt. Dale Sweetnam, who is working with Google's communications department as part of the Army's "Training with Industry" program, writes on the company's official blog:

For servicemen and women who are constantly on the move, having a single number and an easy way to retrieve messages from loved ones can be invaluable. To help our service members communicate with their loved ones and show our support to those serving our country, Google is launching a new program. Starting today, any active U.S. service member with a .mil email address can sign up for a Google Voice account at www.google.com/militaryinvite and start using the free service within a day.

When you deploy, your life is put on hold. While you live and work in a different world, everyone else moves on with life back home. Your family and friends keep moving, and this sometimes means it's just not possible for them to stay awake until 2 a.m. to receive a phone call. Calling Iraq or Afghanistan is seldom an option. ... Google Voice provides a solution to some of these problems.

This is nice too:

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When a dominant hardware platform vendor teams up with a dominant network services provider (AT&T), and then selectively blocks or hobbles software applications on the platform, consumers should smell an anticompetitive rat. After all, if Microsoft had a veto right over every app that ran under Windows, and used that power to selectively ban competitors who "duplicate" functionality offered by Microsoft's own apps, we'd expect competition regulators to be up in arms. The combination of Apple's veto power over the iPhone apps market and AT&T's handset exclusivity arrangement with Apple should also have consumers and regulators on their guard.

Full article: http://www.networkworld.com/community/node/44116?source=NWWNLE_nlt_daily_pm_2009-08-04
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nutballs
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« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2009, 02:58:34 PM »

and see.

that is exactly the reason the Govt doesnt need to get involved. The system worked it self out, and will continue to.
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perkiset
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« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2009, 03:06:33 PM »

Bravo to Google, seeing an opportunity and moving on it. And it looks like they're capitalizing on it nicely.

But the op-ed sort of stops making sense here:

When a dominant hardware platform vendor teams up with a dominant network services provider (AT&T) ...
The argument has been, for the longest time, "Why would you purchase an Apple? They have so little market share that they are a niche player at best." Now they are the dominant hardware platform? Is he seriously suggesting that the iPhone is in a monopoly position in the smart phone segment? Really? It is clearly the fast mover, growing leaps and bounds faster than almost any other smart phone... but note the "almost."

Here is the sales breakdown for Q4 last year:

Note that the iPhone is impressively skootching up. But to put it in the "dominant" category would be rather foolish, no? The haters need it to fail one way or another, much like the Repubs need Dems to look bad in any case. It's either too small, or too big, or too nichey or too dominant.

I dunno. We all see market pressures affecting decisions of big corps all day long. First off, we don't really know who is in charge of that decision: Apple or AT&T. It's probably a concession by Apple for AT&T because, given Apple's motivations, making it bigger/better/faster/more capable is right in line with their intentions. Crippling it because it conflicts with the AT&T business model looks a lot more like it satisfies AT&T than the consumer. But in any case, if market pressure bends the combo to be better for us, hurrah. Natch - Apple took a lot of shit for their DRM, but that was required by the labels. Market pressure made it so that Apple had a strong enough argument to break the hold - which they probably had to negotiate in the first place just to get the deals that they did.

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vsloathe
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« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2009, 03:54:27 PM »

There are no alternatives to the iPhone though.

Not really.

It's fundamentally a different device from anything in its segment. Regardless, Apple needing to vet every application available for install is silly. Let us provide apps for free. No need to support them or anything, just let us deal with it ourselves. I wouldn't stand for a vendor-controlled repository on my OS as the sole option, I wouldn't stand for it anywhere else I can think of. It's not OK simply because it's a phone.

I just read this morning about how a guy got arrested and is looking at years upon years in federal prison because he offered an XBOX modding service. That's right, private citizens brought a piece of their property to him in order to have it altered for a fee, harming no one and no one's rights, and he's looking at federal prison for it. The non-ownership culture that you seem to be OK with is just not OK with me, Perks.
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« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2009, 04:32:11 PM »

There are no alternatives to the iPhone though.

Not really.

It's fundamentally a different device from anything in its segment. Regardless, Apple needing to vet every application available for install is silly. Let us provide apps for free. No need to support them or anything, just let us deal with it ourselves. I wouldn't stand for a vendor-controlled repository on my OS as the sole option, I wouldn't stand for it anywhere else I can think of. It's not OK simply because it's a phone.
Hmm, toughy. An interesting assertion that there are not really any alternatives. Crackberry addicts that I know would argue that till their faces were blue. I think it is fair to say that the iPhone is a game changer, and has tossed the market salad violently, but I have a hard time with the notion that it is equally monopolistic and unique. I personally think it's WAY ahead of other phones, but we see them scrambling to catch up like crazy. It won't be long before other vendors come out with things that rival it in raw capability, perhaps even experience - it will be interesting to see if they develop enough whoomph to gain a toehold. But unique as first-to-market is not necessarily a reason to cry foul though IMO.

The locked-down experience model has been a problem for Apple for a long time, and it is always controversial. The very thing that has made Windows suck, is that it has to work on any lamebrains idea of a clone machine. Apple has had its success because it's done the opposite - restricted the experience and usage of the machine to a very tightly controlled set of apps. Both models have their strong and weak points. I think if the total number of computers out there was reversed, yet the models stayed the same, we'd all be saying it's time for at a Bell-style divestiture pre-1974.

Based on results, you do accept the restrictions because you have an un-jailbroken phone. Your discomfort is similar to mine, when, in 7th grade I did not like padlocks. So I manufactured and sold lock pick kits. Not because I wanted what was behind the door, but because the lock pissed me off. It will remain to be seen if your discomfort is duplicated by enough people that it becomes anti-trust fodder. Perhaps, Apple has never had to deal with such issues because it's never been more than (something like) a 3% player. Now that they are AWAY above the radar, I think you are also correct in the assertion that they will need to change a component of their practices. And I think the market and the screams of pissed off newly-minted Mac users will assist them in that ... adjustment.


I just read this morning about how a guy got arrested and is looking at years upon years in federal prison because he offered an XBOX modding service. That's right, private citizens brought a piece of their property to him in order to have it altered for a fee, harming no one and no one's rights, and he's looking at federal prison for it. The non-ownership culture that you seem to be OK with is just not OK with me, Perks.
Do you have a link for that article? There's just got to be more than this to the story. But that said, I am not into a non-ownership culture, but I believe I am realistic about what I should own, or what I have rights to own. I don't know if the notion of ownership works the same with software. I think you present an interesting question: Should software be lumped into the same type of ownership model as other things? Does it look more like leasing a car than purchasing? There are some big questions there, and Apple may well have opened a huge can or worms with the iTunes Store.

All that said, I find ownership highly overrated. So long as I get what I want personally, I really could care less if I own it. I am more concerned with my quality of life than ownership of things. But I am pleased that there are others, like you and ITTO, that do take up the fight passionately because I benefit. Thank you my friend. (f'reals)
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« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2009, 04:34:47 PM »

>link

Here's one:
http://cbs11tv.com/technology/Modding.Video.Games.2.1113867.html
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perkiset
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« Reply #6 on: August 04, 2009, 04:36:28 PM »

Wait...

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...that he illegally modified video game consoles to enable the machines to play pirated video games.

Enabling is the problem. Ask Shawn Fanning. That's very different than just modding.
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isthisthingon
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« Reply #7 on: August 04, 2009, 04:45:08 PM »

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and see.
that is exactly the reason the Govt doesnt need to get involved. The system worked it self out, and will continue to.

True, the government may not need to get involved, because the government will get involved if they don't change their ways.  More stick than carrot IMO.  Same rules everyone else must follow or suffer the consequences Police  Apple/AT&T are no exceptions to the rules, but Apple enjoys a tireless "cool" pass from people who should hold them just as accountable as anyone else playing badly with others. 

If it was Monoposoft, I have a sneaking suspicion the sentiment would be different coming from the Apple fanbois.  I think this other article puts it nicely: http://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2009/08/fcc-opens-investigations-iphone-app-discrimination

Quote
"... consumers should smell an anticompetitive rat. After all, if Microsoft had a veto right over every app that ran under Windows, and used that power to selectively ban competitors who "duplicate" functionality offered by Microsoft's own apps, we'd expect competition regulators to be up in arms. The combination of Apple's veto power over the iPhone apps market and AT&T's handset exclusivity arrangement with Apple should also have consumers and regulators on their guard."

@vsloathe:
Quote
I just read this morning about how a guy got arrested and is looking at years upon years in federal prison because he offered an XBOX modding service. That's right, private citizens brought a piece of their property to him in order to have it altered for a fee, harming no one and no one's rights, and he's looking at federal prison for it. The non-ownership culture that you seem to be OK with is just not OK with me, Perks.

 Sad  Yuck!!!  The underbelly of the beast.  But opinions on this thread are at a granite impasse and I don't imagine this individual case will change any views.  I'd love to see the article if you still have it vs.
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perkiset
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« Reply #8 on: August 04, 2009, 05:06:18 PM »

Wait, wait ITTO.

If Monoposoft did that then there WOULD be an outcry, because they own what, like 90% of the business desktop market? They ARE a monopoly. Apple is not. Apple enjoys a tireless "cool pass?" C'mon. When you're a 3% player, you can pretty much do what you want because you're not stifling anyone. When you're a 10% player, like they are now, you start to get under the microscope, like they are. And you need to look at your business practices, because you're starting to move into a different sphere. It is fair to analyze what is going on for monopolistic practices. I speculate that it will amount to nothing, because the only monopoly Apple has is on cool.

They are not a monopoly because you can make about a bazillion different choices for phone/computer service. Cool features do not count, never have.
They are not price fixing or in collusion (to my way of thinking) because they have a strategic partnership to gain market share. This is done by all kinds of folks all day long. They cannot control market forces, nor move market share by any other lever than their product's features. IMO, pretty or ugly, that's business.

The real issue to me is that people want what the iPhone does, but are unwilling to accept the terms of service. Well, to me that's a non-issue. If you don't like the terms of service, get something else. No one is point a gun at anyone's head to purchase an iPhone. Again, sort of bugs me, the notion of, "I want YOUR product, but I want it MY way." I really don't see how that is a valid position.
« Last Edit: August 04, 2009, 05:08:17 PM by perkiset » Logged

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isthisthingon
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« Reply #9 on: August 04, 2009, 05:24:38 PM »

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Wait...

...that he illegally modified video game consoles to enable the machines to play pirated video games.

Enabling is the problem. Ask Shawn Fanning. That's very different than just modding.

Quote
No one is point a gun at anyone's head to purchase an iPhone.

Guns, interesting.  You know, you can make, sell, export and import kits to make your guns fully automatic here in America.  You just can't actually use them.  We can thank the lovely NRA for attending to our second amendment "rights".  For most everything else all we have is the individual voice.  It's truly a precious thing that needs all the help it can get, especially when draconian prison sentencing is endured by those who personally suffer for the luxury of our ambivalence.  Hearing about the deaths of people with HIV locked up in prison and denied access to their medical marijuana gets me fired up as well.  I don't smoke pot, so who cares?

Wow, talk about warped standards that we embrace Huh?  Now just consider the impact of actually using the compared products.  Fully automatic firearms and pirated video games.  What universe is this again  Need Help

Quote
... because the only monopoly Apple has is on cool.

Diligently maintained by those who continue to provide them with their tireless "cool pass"  ROFLMAO  None of this would be interesting unless you are passionate about Apple or passionate about individual rights  Idea...  Clearly I fall into the second category and probably just appear to be an Apple hater, which is unfortunate and incorrect.  But to me they are no golden child and need a little  Don't make me... for their recent behavior that ain't gettin a pass from me  Smooch
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vsloathe
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« Reply #10 on: August 04, 2009, 06:55:05 PM »

But that's just it.

*pirated* is the assertion of the company.

Bottom line is it's none of their damn business. What if I just wanted to unlock it so that I could play some game that my friends and I wrote? They shouldn't have put such asinine restrictions on in the first place, but we certainly shouldn't be arrested for trying to circumvent them.
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« Reply #11 on: August 04, 2009, 07:15:16 PM »

I just read this morning about how a guy got arrested and is looking at years upon years in federal prison because he offered an XBOX modding service. That's right, private citizens brought a piece of their property to him in order to have it altered for a fee, harming no one and no one's rights, and he's looking at federal prison for it. The non-ownership culture that you seem to be OK with is just not OK with me, Perks.

http://www.playnoevil.com/serendipity/index.php?/archives/714-Xbox-360-DVD-Drive-Piracy-Spreads-to-the-Philippines.html

Quote
Xbox 360s retail for about 21,000 pesos to 30,000 pesos. The modification itself cost 3,000 pesos.
Technically, flashing or modifying chipsets is not illegal unlike selling of copied discs, which is punishable by law.

Your local mall here offers the service. Also included in the price is the guarantee that if they break it they will give you a new console.
I am very sure that it is illegal here Smiley

Problem is not really the laws, but that stupid people follow them Smiley


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